Pope Francis and the Economy

Discussion of current events
Jim the Moron
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by Jim the Moron » Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:09 am

armchair_pundit wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 10:06 pm
Milo wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:34 pm

Anglicans have celibate orders too but it is a choice.

And Rabbis must be married.

I don't see the connection between celibacy and Sainthood.
Anyone here actually believe that God gives a sh*t about what kind of sex his monkeys are having and with which monkey?
Hey, God can speak for him/herself, but I personally am disturbed at the sight of boy capuchins copulating with girl howler monkeys. And right there in the open!

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Milo
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by Milo » Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:56 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 2:44 am
Milo wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:34 pm

I don't see the connection between celibacy and Sainthood.
No direct connection I am aware of either Milo. I did not mean to lend the impression that there is.
IMO, the RCC can only survive if it reverts to celibacy being a choice.

neverfail
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by neverfail » Sun Feb 17, 2019 7:53 pm

Milo wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:56 pm
neverfail wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 2:44 am
Milo wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:34 pm

I don't see the connection between celibacy and Sainthood.
No direct connection I am aware of either Milo. I did not mean to lend the impression that there is.
IMO, the RCC can only survive if it reverts to celibacy being a choice.
Claim to be a prophet of things to come if you want to, Milo.

In the shorter term Pope Francis is right to call upon all members of the Catholic clergy to abide by their vows of celibacy or get out. Priests who are carnallty attracted to their own gender rather than the female one become harmless as homosexuals as long as they abstain from venting their urge through abstinence from sexual activity. But the same rule applies to hetrosexual Catholic priests. I know that there are plenty of Hetrosexual priests who have taken it upon themselves to lightly treat their vows of celibacy as optional.

To be fair to all: can the Pope credibly demand that one group of priests abide by their vows while letting the other off from the same obligation?

It seems to me that the succession of several popes has simply let this matter drift until it has reached the present dismal crescendo. It has set a bad moral precedent. If the Vatican has been so nonchalant about priests cheating on their vows of celibacy, can they seriously not expect that quite a few married laymen will likewise cheat on their marriage vows?

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Milo
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by Milo » Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:20 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 7:53 pm
Milo wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:56 pm
neverfail wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 2:44 am
Milo wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:34 pm

I don't see the connection between celibacy and Sainthood.
No direct connection I am aware of either Milo. I did not mean to lend the impression that there is.
IMO, the RCC can only survive if it reverts to celibacy being a choice.
Claim to be a prophet of things to come if you want to, Milo.

In the shorter term Pope Francis is right to call upon all members of the Catholic clergy to abide by their vows of celibacy or get out. Priests who are carnallty attracted to their own gender rather than the female one become harmless as homosexuals as long as they abstain from venting their urge through abstinence from sexual activity. But the same rule applies to hetrosexual Catholic priests. I know that there are plenty of Hetrosexual priests who have taken it upon themselves to lightly treat their vows of celibacy as optional.

To be fair to all: can the Pope credibly demand that one group of priests abide by their vows while letting the other off from the same obligation?

It seems to me that the succession of several popes has simply let this matter drift until it has reached the present dismal crescendo. It has set a bad moral precedent. If the Vatican has been so nonchalant about priests cheating on their vows of celibacy, can they seriously not expect that quite a few married laymen will likewise cheat on their marriage vows?
But celibacy is NOT demanded of all RCC Priests!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Catholic_Churches

Especially when the RCC wants to poach Anglican Priests!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_ordinariate

neverfail
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by neverfail » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:27 pm

Milo wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:20 pm

But celibacy is NOT demanded of all RCC Priests!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Catholic_Churches
Thanks for pointing that out to me Milo.

Outside of members of these subgroupings all catholic priests have to enter into the vow of celibacy.

My own private opinion (and that of most other informed Catholics, including a majority of our priests) is that our Church would probably do itself a favour if it were to depart from this hoary old tradition (it dates from around 900AD and was instituted to bring an end to the scandal of widespread simony). But can I see the Vatican doing the sensible thing and follow in the footsteps of your church? Not with the present crowd incumbency in the Curia.
Milo wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:20 pm
Especially when the RCC wants to poach Anglican Priests!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_ordinariate
"Poaching" them? What seems to happen is that occasionally a high Anglican priest gets pissed off with his own church establishment for some reason or another and decided that his vocation lies in becoming a Catholic priest. This is nothing new either. The illustrious John Henry Newman seems to have started that trend way back in the 19th century:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_Newman

:D

Just over 6 months ago we (my wife and I) were introduced to one such ex-Anglican priest in your home country. He was/is the parish priest in the area of British Columbia where our hostess is resident. My wife especially was very favourably impressed by this man. He was a rather jolly, charismatic priest who gave the impression of enjoying pastoral and social interaction with his parishioners.

My wife attributes his virtue for effortless "people's person" interaction to the fact that he brought his wife with him from his previous time in the Anglican Church. To do this he had to apply for and be granted a special dispensation (from vow of celibacy) by the Pope. Yet having the backing of a loving wife seems to have reaped enormous dividends in enabling him to be a highly effective and much loved pastor.

I hope and pray that your church can continue to furnish my Church of more priests of similar caliber Milo. It partly makes up for the shortfall of religious vocations anong Catholic men.

I don't know about you Milo, but I have found over the years that sex helps me to feel more "alive".

My observation is that to many of our Catholic clergy who honour their vows of celibacy end up given the impression of being rather "dried out" by the time they reach middle age.

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Milo
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Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by Milo » Wed Feb 20, 2019 8:12 pm

neverfail wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:27 pm
Milo wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:20 pm

But celibacy is NOT demanded of all RCC Priests!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Catholic_Churches
Thanks for pointing that out to me Milo.

Outside of members of these subgroupings all catholic priests have to enter into the vow of celibacy.

My own private opinion (and that of most other informed Catholics, including a majority of our priests) is that our Church would probably do itself a favour if it were to depart from this hoary old tradition (it dates from around 900AD and was instituted to bring an end to the scandal of widespread simony). But can I see the Vatican doing the sensible thing and follow in the footsteps of your church? Not with the present crowd incumbency in the Curia.
Milo wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:20 pm
Especially when the RCC wants to poach Anglican Priests!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_ordinariate
"Poaching" them? What seems to happen is that occasionally a high Anglican priest gets pissed off with his own church establishment for some reason or another and decided that his vocation lies in becoming a Catholic priest. This is nothing new either. The illustrious John Henry Newman seems to have started that trend way back in the 19th century:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_Newman

:D

Just over 6 months ago we (my wife and I) were introduced to one such ex-Anglican priest in your home country. He was/is the parish priest in the area of British Columbia where our hostess is resident. My wife especially was very favourably impressed by this man. He was a rather jolly, charismatic priest who gave the impression of enjoying pastoral and social interaction with his parishioners.

My wife attributes his virtue for effortless "people's person" interaction to the fact that he brought his wife with him from his previous time in the Anglican Church. To do this he had to apply for and be granted a special dispensation (from vow of celibacy) by the Pope. Yet having the backing of a loving wife seems to have reaped enormous dividends in enabling him to be a highly effective and much loved pastor.

I hope and pray that your church can continue to furnish my Church of more priests of similar caliber Milo. It partly makes up for the shortfall of religious vocations anong Catholic men.

I don't know about you Milo, but I have found over the years that sex helps me to feel more "alive".

My observation is that to many of our Catholic clergy who honour their vows of celibacy end up given the impression of being rather "dried out" by the time they reach middle age.
Agree with all of the above!

neverfail
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Re: Pope Francis and clerical sexual abuse.

Post by neverfail » Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:26 am

The Catholic Church’s Battle Between Rhetoric and Reality
Pope Francis wants “concrete” change over the Church’s child sexual-abuse scandal. It won’t be easy, though.

https://www.theatlantic.com/internation ... ow/583297/

neverfail
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Location: Singapore

Re: Pope Francis and clerical sexual abuse

Post by neverfail » Sun Feb 24, 2019 6:07 pm

https://www.theage.com.au/national/what ... 5100n.html

What the Pope didn’t say when he blamed the devil for child sex abuse.

neverfail
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Location: Singapore

Re: Pope Francis and the Economy

Post by neverfail » Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:44 pm

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/nation ... 50m86.html

Cardinal George Pell has been found guilty and is set to be jailed for child sexual abuse in the most sensational verdict since the Catholic church became engulfed in worldwide abuse scandals.

Pell, who was Vatican treasurer, close to the Pope and one of the most senior Catholic figures in the world to be charged with child sex offences, has been found guilty of orally raping one choirboy and molesting another in Melbourne’s St Patrick’s Cathedral 22 years ago.

Australian media has been unable to report the guilty verdict until now, due to a suppression order.
That's one down. Now, how many more to go?

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