Beware of Germany

Discussion of current events
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cassowary
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Beware of Germany

Post by cassowary » Sun May 27, 2018 6:08 pm


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Sertorio
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Sertorio » Mon May 28, 2018 5:06 am

cassowary wrote:
Sun May 27, 2018 6:08 pm
The German Meltdown
A load of crap mixed with a few true observations. A perfect example of useless writing by a very biased writer...

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cassowary
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by cassowary » Mon May 28, 2018 5:44 am

Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:06 am
cassowary wrote:
Sun May 27, 2018 6:08 pm
The German Meltdown
A load of crap mixed with a few true observations. A perfect example of useless writing by a very biased writer...
In your opinion, what is crap and what is true?

Jim the Moron
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Jim the Moron » Mon May 28, 2018 5:52 am

Yes, Sertorio, what precisely are your objections?

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Sertorio
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Sertorio » Mon May 28, 2018 8:02 am

Jim the Moron wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:52 am
Yes, Sertorio, what precisely are your objections?
1. "Germany’s neighbors in 1870, 1914, 1939—and increasingly in the present—usually bear the brunt of this national meltdown."
What meltdown occurred in 1870? Germany won the war against France and founded the II Empire.
2. "On mass immigration, it is beginning to terrify the nearby nations of Eastern Europe."
Mass immigration in Germany may be a problem for Germans, but why would it terrify the 'nearby nations of Eastern Europe' ?
3. "In a fit of fear, after the Japanese Fukushima Daiichi nuclear reactor meltdown in 2011, and in a huff about climate change, Berlin more or less abruptly junked traditionally generated electrical power and opted for inefficient and unreliable “green” renewable wind and solar—despite the less than Mediterranean nature of its climate and warnings of the financial downside. The result is that electricity costs have climbed 50 percent in recent years and are among the most expensive in the developed world—and electricity itself is sometimes scarce."
Bull!... Figures, please...
4. "Until recently, a mostly homogenous Germany had little experience with diversity, much less with assimilating and integrating mostly impoverished, male, Muslim immigrants."
Bull!... Turkish immigrants started arriving in 1961 and, by 1973, there were over 700,000 such immigrants in Germany. Today they are over 4 million, 2.5 million of whom have German citizenship.
5. "Germany has gone from spiked helmets to Weimar pacifism, from the Waffen SS to Potemkin divisions and gossamer air wings. Berlin never quite seems to realize that had it just followed the classical golden mean—strong armed forces under the auspices of Democratic government—it would have neither scared its neighbors nor required 70 years of subsidized postwar defense dependence."
Which neighbours are scared of Germany? Who subsidizes Germany's defense?...

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cassowary
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by cassowary » Mon May 28, 2018 8:22 am

Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:02 am
Jim the Moron wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:52 am
Yes, Sertorio, what precisely are your objections?
1. "Germany’s neighbors in 1870, 1914, 1939—and increasingly in the present—usually bear the brunt of this national meltdown."
What meltdown occurred in 1870? Germany won the war against France and founded the II Empire.
What the writer meant by meltdown was a German sense of victimhood leading to German chauvinism and I suppose aggression towards its neighbors. He was not talking about victory or defeat.
2. "On mass immigration, it is beginning to terrify the nearby nations of Eastern Europe."
Mass immigration in Germany may be a problem for Germans, but why would it terrify the 'nearby nations of Eastern Europe' ?
You have forgotten that the EU is supposed to have open borders with one another. This means that Muslim refugees in Germany are entitled to settle anywhere else. An invitation to go to Germany is an invitation to go to the rest of the EU.
3. "In a fit of fear, after the Japanese Fukushima Daiichi nuclear reactor meltdown in 2011, and in a huff about climate change, Berlin more or less abruptly junked traditionally generated electrical power and opted for inefficient and unreliable “green” renewable wind and solar—despite the less than Mediterranean nature of its climate and warnings of the financial downside. The result is that electricity costs have climbed 50 percent in recent years and are among the most expensive in the developed world—and electricity itself is sometimes scarce."
Bull!... Figures, please...
According to this article, Germany's cost of energy is nearly twice that of the US.

Image
5. "Germany has gone from spiked helmets to Weimar pacifism, from the Waffen SS to Potemkin divisions and gossamer air wings. Berlin never quite seems to realize that had it just followed the classical golden mean—strong armed forces under the auspices of Democratic government—it would have neither scared its neighbors nor required 70 years of subsidized postwar defense dependence."
Which neighbours are scared of Germany? Who subsidizes Germany's defense?...
Top
Germany's neighbors in 1870, 1914 and 1939 were certainly scared of the Germans. The US is indirectly subsidizing Germany's defence (and many other European countries). Because the US defends Germany and all NATO countries, Germany did not bother to spend enough on defence to protect them from the Russians.
Last edited by cassowary on Mon May 28, 2018 8:39 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Sertorio
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Sertorio » Mon May 28, 2018 8:26 am

cassowary wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:22 am
Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:02 am
Jim the Moron wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:52 am
Yes, Sertorio, what precisely are your objections?
1. "Germany’s neighbors in 1870, 1914, 1939—and increasingly in the present—usually bear the brunt of this national meltdown."
What meltdown occurred in 1870? Germany won the war against France and founded the II Empire.
What the writer meant by meltdown was a German sense of victimhood leading to German chauvinism and I suppose aggression towards its neighbors. He was not talking about victory or defeat.
Why would a victory over France generate in Germany a "sense of victimhood"?...

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cassowary
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by cassowary » Mon May 28, 2018 8:42 am

Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:26 am
cassowary wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:22 am
Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:02 am
Jim the Moron wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:52 am
Yes, Sertorio, what precisely are your objections?
1. "Germany’s neighbors in 1870, 1914, 1939—and increasingly in the present—usually bear the brunt of this national meltdown."
What meltdown occurred in 1870? Germany won the war against France and founded the II Empire.
What the writer meant by meltdown was a German sense of victimhood leading to German chauvinism and I suppose aggression towards its neighbors. He was not talking about victory or defeat.
Why would a victory over France generate in Germany a "sense of victimhood"?...
You got it backwards. A feeling of victimhood led to German belligerence towards France. This did produce victory in 1870. It is not victory that produced victimhood. It was feeling of victimhood which led to belligerence which led to victory.

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Sertorio
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Sertorio » Mon May 28, 2018 8:58 am

cassowary wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:42 am
Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:26 am

Why would a victory over France generate in Germany a "sense of victimhood"?...
You got it backwards. A feeling of victimhood led to German belligerence towards France. This did produce victory in 1870. It is not victory that produced victimhood. It was feeling of victimhood which led to belligerence which led to victory.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of ... ussian_War
The causes of the Franco-Prussian War are deeply rooted in the events surrounding the German unification. In the aftermath of the Austro-Prussian War (1866), Prussia had annexed numerous territories and formed the North German Confederation. Prussia then turned its attention towards the south of Germany, where it sought to expand its influence.

France was strongly opposed to the annexation of the Southern German States (Bavaria, Wurttemberg, Baden and Hesse), which would have created too powerful a country next to its border. In Prussia, a war against France was deemed necessary to arouse German nationalism in those States that would allow the unification of a great German empire. This aim was epitomized by Prussian Chancellor Otto von Bismarck's quote: "I knew that a Franco-Prussian War must take place before a united Germany was formed."Bismarck also knew that France should be the aggressor in the conflict to bring the Southern German States to side with Prussia, hence giving Germans numerical superiority.

The immediate cause of the war resided in the candidacy of a Prussian prince to the throne of Spain –– France feared encirclement by an alliance between Prussia and Spain. The Hohenzollern prince's candidacy was withdrawn under French diplomatic pressure, but Otto von Bismarck goaded the French into declaring war by altering a telegram sent by William I. Releasing the Ems Telegram to the public, Bismarck made it sound as if the king had treated the French envoy in a demeaning fashion. Six days later, France declared war on Prussia and Southern German States immediately sided with Prussia.
Nothing here would justify any feeling of victimhood on the part of Prussia. And France declared war, not Prussia...

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Sertorio
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Re: Beware of Germany

Post by Sertorio » Mon May 28, 2018 9:36 am

cassowary wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:22 am
Sertorio wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 8:02 am
3. "In a fit of fear, after the Japanese Fukushima Daiichi nuclear reactor meltdown in 2011, and in a huff about climate change, Berlin more or less abruptly junked traditionally generated electrical power and opted for inefficient and unreliable “green” renewable wind and solar—despite the less than Mediterranean nature of its climate and warnings of the financial downside. The result is that electricity costs have climbed 50 percent in recent years and are among the most expensive in the developed world—and electricity itself is sometimes scarce."
Bull!... Figures, please...
According to this article, Germany's cost of energy is nearly twice that of the US.
Well, I was wrong, at least as far as this point was concerned. Germany's energy costs are indeed as high as stated, due mostly to the imposition of renewables. However we should take two things under consideration:

1. In time, costs of renewables will come down and will make them truly competitive.

2. The higher cost of the renewable forms of energy are compensated by doing away with the negative externalities of carbon dioxide emissions and other forms of polution. If those benefits were discounted on the energy prices, renewables might be already fully competitive.

Altogether, I think Germany is right and we should see this as a plus point.

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