The left should be happy with Biden

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neverfail
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by neverfail » Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:38 pm

cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:54 pm

That is also true Neverfail. But educational attainments and size of portfolios can be easily quantified. The size of a loving heart cannot.
That observation is correct and as a consequence even I cannot advocate it as the basis for an immigration policy; and that is the pity of it.

Cassowary, you only need to live in a major Australian metropolitan population centre like Sydney or Melbourne to comprehend just how much we Australians-by-birth are crowded by foreign immigrants. A real Tower of Babel scenario. I do not as a rule object to these people being here but if I had to make a clear choice in the matter I would much prefer to rub shoulders with people endowed with loving hearts (even with only an average level of formal education) than by overrated holders of PH.D's clinging to a sense of entitlement.

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neverfail
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by neverfail » Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:44 pm

cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 9:47 am

1)If they are from the Third World, your standard of living will fall because of their poor education.
That perception is false. Experience both here and in the USA is that while some individuals become criminals (well, even some among the locally born some do that) the majority of resettled immigrants and refugees sourced from these countries have drive and ambition to self-improve in their adopted country. More so usually than is average among the locals.

The probable reason is that they, unlike we, have something to prove.

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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by SteveFoerster » Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:29 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:27 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:47 pm

Australia requires a minimum investment of $2.5 million to get citizenship.

No Cassowary. We are not so mercenary out here that we sell citizenship rights to foreign well-heeled Little Lord Big Egos like you allege. An investment like that allows such aspirants only permissive residence in Australia: and that only after the applicant passes police checks etc for any evidence of past criminal activity etc like any other would-be immigrant to Australia.

Even after arrival in Australia he (or she) is still only here "on probation" for the following three years before that person can apply for citizenship; the same as any other foreign immigrant - and if they break the law or do anything else that. They still have to "jump through the usually hoops": which is only fair and equable to all concerned.
To be honest, that really just sounds like selling citizenship with extra steps. The US does it too.
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cassowary
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by cassowary » Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:36 pm

SteveFoerster wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:29 pm
neverfail wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:27 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:47 pm

Australia requires a minimum investment of $2.5 million to get citizenship.

No Cassowary. We are not so mercenary out here that we sell citizenship rights to foreign well-heeled Little Lord Big Egos like you allege. An investment like that allows such aspirants only permissive residence in Australia: and that only after the applicant passes police checks etc for any evidence of past criminal activity etc like any other would-be immigrant to Australia.

Even after arrival in Australia he (or she) is still only here "on probation" for the following three years before that person can apply for citizenship; the same as any other foreign immigrant - and if they break the law or do anything else that. They still have to "jump through the usually hoops": which is only fair and equable to all concerned.
To be honest, that really just sounds like selling citizenship with extra steps. The US does it too.
Everybody is doing it, Steve. The US has laws that do it. But these laws are not enforced. That’s because some Americans are too permissive with illegal immigrants and allow, condone and even eNcourage them to break the law.
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cassowary
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by cassowary » Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:38 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:38 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:54 pm

That is also true Neverfail. But educational attainments and size of portfolios can be easily quantified. The size of a loving heart cannot.
That observation is correct and as a consequence even I cannot advocate it as the basis for an immigration policy; and that is the pity of it.

Cassowary, you only need to live in a major Australian metropolitan population centre like Sydney or Melbourne to comprehend just how much we Australians-by-birth are crowded by foreign immigrants. A real Tower of Babel scenario. I do not as a rule object to these people being here but if I had to make a clear choice in the matter I would much prefer to rub shoulders with people endowed with loving hearts (even with only an average level of formal education) than by overrated holders of PH.D's clinging to a sense of entitlement.
Yes, Australians are a kind and generous people who allow people from war torn countries to enter.
The Imp :D

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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by SteveFoerster » Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:48 pm

cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:36 pm
Everybody is doing it, Steve. The US has laws that do it. But these laws are not enforced.
Huh?
cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:36 pm
That’s because some Americans are too permissive with illegal immigrants and allow, condone and even eNcourage them to break the law.
I realise unregistered immigration is your favourite bogeyman these days, but we were talking about programmes that offer residency to investors, which has nothing whatsoever to do with that.
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cassowary
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by cassowary » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:17 pm

SteveFoerster wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:48 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:36 pm
Everybody is doing it, Steve. The US has laws that do it. But these laws are not enforced.
Huh?
cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:36 pm
That’s because some Americans are too permissive with illegal immigrants and allow, condone and even eNcourage them to break the law.
I realise unregistered immigration is your favourite bogeyman these days, but we were talking about programmes that offer residency to investors, which has nothing whatsoever to do with that.
Your laws were intended to get well educated people or rich people as immigrants. The intention is thwarted because you allow illegals to enter. So instead of rich , or well educated immigrants, you are getting poor and uneducated people. That’s what I meant.
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by SteveFoerster » Sun Jul 31, 2022 6:04 am

cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:17 pm
Your laws were intended to get well educated people or rich people as immigrants.
They're not my laws. Anyway, while there are programmes for high net worth individuals and other supposedly exceptional people, US immigration law is actually primarily designed around allowing the family members of those already in the US to come, even though it's so poorly administered that it may not always seem like it to those family members.
cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:17 pm
The intention is thwarted because you allow illegals to enter.
Not at all, since wealthy people who want to come do so anyway.
cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:17 pm
So instead of rich , or well educated immigrants, you are getting poor and uneducated people. That’s what I meant.
Realistically, the US ends up with both. Just because people are coming in the back door doesn't stop anyone from coming in the front door.
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neverfail
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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by neverfail » Mon Aug 01, 2022 4:48 am

cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:38 pm
Yes, Australians are a kind and generous people who allow people from war torn countries to enter.
A large part of the reason for this is because we feel secure within our own borders.

A significant reason for that sense of security is because our border policing policy is very ungenerous towards those seeking to enter this country illegally.

As a consequence the consensus of public opinion in this country is not opposed to the admission of bona-fide refugees.

In the USA they have problems relating to illegal immigration and border policing because of geography. Alas for the USA it is not an island-continent.

I am sure that Canada would operate a regime of border controls a lot like ours - so the US-Canadian border is not a problem and is likely not heavily policed as a consequence. Mexico though, I believe, is a lot like the wild West in the old days and for US immigration controls that makes this country a headache.

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Re: The left should be happy with Biden

Post by SteveFoerster » Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:47 am

neverfail wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 4:48 am
In the USA they have problems relating to illegal immigration and border policing because of geography. Alas for the USA it is not an island-continent.
More unregistered immigrants are in the US from overstaying a visa than from clandestinely crossing the border.
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