Finland & Sweden about to join NATO

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neverfail
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Re: Finland & Sweden about to join NATO

Post by neverfail » Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:12 pm

cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:34 am


Well, in day-to-day operations, perhaps. But in terms of overall policy, especially for something as far-reaching as military policy, there must be consensus.
Consensus for such a large group is impossible. There will be a cacophony of voices and opinions. Also should everybody’s opinion carry the same weight. Should a tiny country with Small military have equal weight to the US and Germany?[/quote]

In the case of the NATO alliance I agree in principle with the above when it comes to the internal politics of NATO's member governments. The risk however is that when individual governments of member states find that NATO policy clashes with vital national interests they will be tempted to defect (bearing in mind that the alliance is, after aLll, a voluntary association of states).
You need a weighted voting system based on contribution to contribution to collective defence. By the way, I favor weighted voting for choosing our leaders.
Yes, I know you do. As though there were not enough money politics corruption in the US system already you apparently want to take it further with a "bought" Senate elected by plutocrats only.

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cassowary
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Re: Finland & Sweden about to join NATO

Post by cassowary » Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:53 am

neverfail wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:12 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:34 am


Well, in day-to-day operations, perhaps. But in terms of overall policy, especially for something as far-reaching as military policy, there must be consensus.
Consensus for such a large group is impossible. There will be a cacophony of voices and opinions. Also should everybody’s opinion carry the same weight. Should a tiny country with Small military have equal weight to the US and Germany?
In the case of the NATO alliance I agree in principle with the above when it comes to the internal politics of NATO's member governments. The risk however is that when individual governments of member states find that NATO policy clashes with vital national interests they will be tempted to defect (bearing in mind that the alliance is, after aLll, a voluntary association of states).
You need a weighted voting system based on contribution to contribution to collective defence. By the way, I favor weighted voting for choosing our leaders.
Yes, I know you do. As though there were not enough money politics corruption in the US system already you apparently want to take it further with a "bought" Senate elected by plutocrats only.
[/quote]

The plutocrats are not United. An owner of a green company eg Elon Musk may be opposed by an oil baron. Besides there are not many billionaires. The middle class outnumbers the billionaire class. Though individually, each middle class person does not have much income and hence votes. But collectively, the votes from the middle class will be more than the combined total number of votes from the billionaire class.
The Imp :D

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neverfail
Posts: 8888
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Location: Australia

Re: Finland & Sweden about to join NATO

Post by neverfail » Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:59 pm

cassowary wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:53 am
neverfail wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:12 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:34 am


Well, in day-to-day operations, perhaps. But in terms of overall policy, especially for something as far-reaching as military policy, there must be consensus.
Consensus for such a large group is impossible. There will be a cacophony of voices and opinions. Also should everybody’s opinion carry the same weight. Should a tiny country with Small military have equal weight to the US and Germany?
In the case of the NATO alliance I agree in principle with the above when it comes to the internal politics of NATO's member governments. The risk however is that when individual governments of member states find that NATO policy clashes with vital national interests they will be tempted to defect (bearing in mind that the alliance is, after aLll, a voluntary association of states).
You need a weighted voting system based on contribution to contribution to collective defence. By the way, I favor weighted voting for choosing our leaders.
Yes, I know you do. As though there were not enough money politics corruption in the US system already you apparently want to take it further with a "bought" Senate elected by plutocrats only.
The plutocrats are not United. An owner of a green company eg Elon Musk may be opposed by an oil baron. Besides there are not many billionaires. The middle class outnumbers the billionaire class. Though individually, each middle class person does not have much income and hence votes. But collectively, the votes from the middle class will be more than the combined total number of votes from the billionaire class.
[/quote]

Cass, you seem to have technically screwed up on publishing the above. I did not post those words attributed to me. Nor did you. :)

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cassowary
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Re: Finland & Sweden about to join NATO

Post by cassowary » Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:24 am

Neverfail wrote:
Well, in day-to-day operations, perhaps. But in terms of overall policy, especially for something as far-reaching as military policy, there must be consensus.
Cassowary wrote:
Consensus for such a large group is impossible. There will be a cacophony of voices and opinions. Also should everybody’s opinion carry the same weight. Should a tiny country with Small military have equal weight to the US and Germany?
Neverfail wrote:
In the case of the NATO alliance I agree in principle with the above when it comes to the internal politics of NATO's member governments. The risk however is that when individual governments of member states find that NATO policy clashes with vital national interests they will be tempted to defect (bearing in mind that the alliance is, after aLll, a voluntary association of states).

Cassowary wrote:
You need a weighted voting system based on contribution to contribution to collective defence. By the way, I favor weighted voting for choosing our leaders.
Neverfail wrote:
Yes, I know you do. As though there were not enough money politics corruption in the US system already you apparently want to take it further with a "bought" Senate elected by plutocrats only.


Cassowary wrote:
The plutocrats are not United. An owner of a green company eg Elon Musk may be opposed by an oil baron. Besides there are not many billionaires. The middle class outnumbers the billionaire class. Though individually, each middle class person does not have much income and hence votes. But collectively, the votes from the middle class will be more than the combined total number of votes from the billionaire class.
There. I fixed it.
The Imp :D

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