Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Discussion of current events
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cassowary
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by cassowary » Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:28 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:15 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:30 am
neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:14 am
Sertorio,

He won't! Knowing dear Cassowary he will probably next try to claim that it was Brooks' fault that he was killed for placing himself in the trajectory of the bullets when the cop fired his pistol. :lol:
I said no such thing. I said he was mostly responsible for his death because he got drunk, drove while intoxicated, resisted arrest, punched a police officer, stole his taser, and shot the policeman with his taser.
Oh sure - and I suppose that this counts as a hanging offence in your mind?

Worse still; it gives any cop a licence to act as judge, jury and executione; draw his service revolver and shoot down such a minor offender at will, doesn't it?

I am sure that even the Atlanta police department has rules and guidelines as to when and under what circumstances a police officer employee is permitted to draw his side arm and use it.

Spare me your spurious abstract logic Cassowary.
I said no such thing. All I said was it’s mostly Brooks fault.
The Imp :D

neverfail
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by neverfail » Sun Jun 21, 2020 5:49 pm

cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:28 pm
neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:15 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:30 am
neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:14 am
Sertorio,

He won't! Knowing dear Cassowary he will probably next try to claim that it was Brooks' fault that he was killed for placing himself in the trajectory of the bullets when the cop fired his pistol. :lol:
I said no such thing. I said he was mostly responsible for his death because he got drunk, drove while intoxicated, resisted arrest, punched a police officer, stole his taser, and shot the policeman with his taser.
Oh sure - and I suppose that this counts as a hanging offence in your mind?

Worse still; it gives any cop a licence to act as judge, jury and executione; draw his service revolver and shoot down such a minor offender at will, doesn't it?

I am sure that even the Atlanta police department has rules and guidelines as to when and under what circumstances a police officer employee is permitted to draw his side arm and use it.

Spare me your spurious abstract logic Cassowary.
I said no such thing. All I said was it’s mostly Brooks fault.
I know what you said Cassowary.

Do the police in Singapore have an unrestrasined licence to go around shooting whoever they want to?

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cassowary
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by cassowary » Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:18 pm

neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 5:49 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:28 pm
neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:15 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:30 am
neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:14 am
Sertorio,

He won't! Knowing dear Cassowary he will probably next try to claim that it was Brooks' fault that he was killed for placing himself in the trajectory of the bullets when the cop fired his pistol. :lol:
I said no such thing. I said he was mostly responsible for his death because he got drunk, drove while intoxicated, resisted arrest, punched a police officer, stole his taser, and shot the policeman with his taser.
Oh sure - and I suppose that this counts as a hanging offence in your mind?

Worse still; it gives any cop a licence to act as judge, jury and executione; draw his service revolver and shoot down such a minor offender at will, doesn't it?

I am sure that even the Atlanta police department has rules and guidelines as to when and under what circumstances a police officer employee is permitted to draw his side arm and use it.

Spare me your spurious abstract logic Cassowary.
I said no such thing. All I said was it’s mostly Brooks fault.
I know what you said Cassowary.

Do the police in Singapore have an unrestrasined licence to go around shooting whoever they want to?
I don't know what the rules are in Singapore governing when the police are allowed to shoot. We have to see what the rules are in Atlanta. If the policeman violated the rules, then he should be punished. Does getting hit on the face permit him to shoot? What about a knife attack? Does an attempt to shoot him with a taser give him the right of self defense? I have a feeling it might be a grey area.

A taser is not meant to kill. But it can knock you unconscious. I read somewhere of a actual case where an officer was knocked unconscious by a rock. Then the assailant stole his gun and shot him dead. A policeman risks his life to protect the public. We need to support them or they can't protect you.

So to protect ourselves, we need to err on the side of the police. A murder charge seems to be over the top.

.................................................................................................................................

This is the other side of the coin:

Alabama officer beaten unconscious by assailant with his own weapon was mocked online. He said he was afraid to use his weapon in the wake of the Ferguson riot.

Do you want these people to resign? Who is going to protect you?

...........................................................................................................................

I am starting a new thread that is related to this one. The power of personal agency.
The Imp :D

neverfail
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by neverfail » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:53 pm

cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:18 pm
We have to see what the rules are in Atlanta. If the policeman violated the rules, then he should be punished. Does getting hit on the face permit him to shoot? What about a knife attack? Does an attempt to shoot him with a taser give him the right of self defense? I have a feeling it might be a grey area.
Apart from rules re. the conduct of police officers there is still the civil code of common law that applies to everyone. Among those laws are laws against murder. Garrett Rolfe, the cop who shot Rayshard Brooks has been charged with murder under the civil code. The authorities would not have done that lightly but going by the evidence (above all the video of the incident taken at the time) it looks like an open and shut case of homicide. No "grey area" at all Cassowary.

So why, despite the evidence staring you in the face, do you still try to justify homicide committed by a cop?

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Sertorio
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by Sertorio » Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:14 am

neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:53 pm

So why, despite the evidence staring you in the face, do you still try to justify homicide committed by a cop?
Because for Cass, the only good Indian is a dead Indian...

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cassowary
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by cassowary » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:48 am

neverfail wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:53 pm
cassowary wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:18 pm
We have to see what the rules are in Atlanta. If the policeman violated the rules, then he should be punished. Does getting hit on the face permit him to shoot? What about a knife attack? Does an attempt to shoot him with a taser give him the right of self defense? I have a feeling it might be a grey area.
Apart from rules re. the conduct of police officers there is still the civil code of common law that applies to everyone. Among those laws are laws against murder. Garrett Rolfe, the cop who shot Rayshard Brooks has been charged with murder under the civil code. The authorities would not have done that lightly but going by the evidence (above all the video of the incident taken at the time) it looks like an open and shut case of homicide. No "grey area" at all Cassowary.

So why, despite the evidence staring you in the face, do you still try to justify homicide committed by a cop?
Because the AG, Paul Howard who charged the cop for murder, is himself under investigation for stealing most of the money that was donated for a worthy cause.

Don't forget AGs in the US are elected. He is a politician. He sees which way the political winds are blowing. If he loses power, he could be jailed if found guilty. Now, if he is faces trial, he is going to tell his supporters that he is innocent and racists want him out because he went after a racist cop.

The former cop's lawyer is asking why Howard rushed to charged him before the Georgia Bureau of Investigation finished its investigation, a departure from normal practice.

You must understand that the Americans do things differently than in Australia. Prosecutions are sometimes politically motivated. In this case, it is motivated by Howard's desire for survival and maybe to stay out of jail, if he is guilty.

That aside, I have no idea if the ex-cop is guilty of murder or not. It depends on what Georgian law says. When is a police officer justified in shooting? That is the key question.

It is not an open and shut case for murder.
The Imp :D

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cassowary
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by cassowary » Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:57 am

Neverfail,

I believe the ex cop stand a good chance of being found not guilty of all charges by simply pleading self defence. After checking, I found that the Taser can kill. According to Amnesty International , the taser had killed more than 300 people in the US.

So the ex-cop’s life was in danger albeit not as much as when faced with a gunman.
The Imp :D

neverfail
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by neverfail » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:02 pm

cassowary wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:57 am
Neverfail,

I believe the ex cop stand a good chance of being found not guilty of all charges by simply pleading self defence. After checking, I found that the Taser can kill. According to Amnesty International , the taser had killed more than 300 people in the US.

So the ex-cop’s life was in danger albeit not as much as when faced with a gunman.
I stand by the evidence in the form of the video of the incident.

Garrett Rolfe was NOT defending himself against attack by Rayshard Brooks. He did not draw his service side are until after the latter had struggled himself free and was fleeing in blind fear (probably with reason). Instead the cop set out in pursuit of the fleeing Brooks and shot him down then - in my books that counts as a premeditated attack, not as self-defence. As for Brooks stolen taser he was shooting it wildly behind him while on the run from his pursuer - that counts physically as an act of defence.

If I know anything about The South: had Rayshard Brooks been a white motorist caught drunk and asleep blocking the exit lane from the fast food outlet pick-up window like that - the likely outcome might have been that cop Garrett Rolfe would have given him a stern warning and told him to drive his car over to a vacant parking space nearby and sleep it off - as worst having served him with a ticket with a fine attached if that is the penalty under Georgia law for a minor traffic infringement like that. The fact that Brooks was black likely prompted him and police colleague to choose the path of attempted arrest - unnecessary considering the softer alternative option rweadily available.

I am at a loss to understand how you could be so damned biased that you ignore the evidence staring you in the face.

(I presume they would have run the video footage over Singapore TV news unedited - as elsewhere in the World - and that you would have seen it sometime.)

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Milo
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by Milo » Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:32 pm

neverfail wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:02 pm
cassowary wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:57 am
Neverfail,

I believe the ex cop stand a good chance of being found not guilty of all charges by simply pleading self defence. After checking, I found that the Taser can kill. According to Amnesty International , the taser had killed more than 300 people in the US.

So the ex-cop’s life was in danger albeit not as much as when faced with a gunman.
I stand by the evidence in the form of the video of the incident.

Garrett Rolfe was NOT defending himself against attack by Rayshard Brooks. He did not draw his service side are until after the latter had struggled himself free and was fleeing in blind fear (probably with reason). Instead the cop set out in pursuit of the fleeing Brooks and shot him down then - in my books that counts as a premeditated attack, not as self-defence. As for Brooks stolen taser he was shooting it wildly behind him while on the run from his pursuer - that counts physically as an act of defence.

If I know anything about The South: had Rayshard Brooks been a white motorist caught drunk and asleep blocking the exit lane from the fast food outlet pick-up window like that - the likely outcome might have been that cop Garrett Rolfe would have given him a stern warning and told him to drive his car over to a vacant parking space nearby and sleep it off - as worst having served him with a ticket with a fine attached if that is the penalty under Georgia law for a minor traffic infringement like that. The fact that Brooks was black likely prompted him and police colleague to choose the path of attempted arrest - unnecessary considering the softer alternative option rweadily available.

I am at a loss to understand how you could be so damned biased that you ignore the evidence staring you in the face.

(I presume they would have run the video footage over Singapore TV news unedited - as elsewhere in the World - and that you would have seen it sometime.)
Cass never heard a right wing propaganda piece he didn't like.

neverfail
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Re: Can't keep them on the plantation any mo'

Post by neverfail » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:14 pm

Milo wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:32 pm

Cass never heard a right wing propaganda piece he didn't like.
A pity when they become so politically biased through it that they lose touch with reality.

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