The worst Prime Minister in history?

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neverfail
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The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by neverfail » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:53 pm

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/world/ ... 50ls0.html
Anyone passing close to the Royal Chelsea Hospital cemetery, and who hears a mighty rumbling, need not fear an earth tremor - because that sound will surely be Margaret Thatcher turning in her grave.
Theresa May,
you have surely had your day.
The future of your country is at play.
Theresa May,
So now please do not stay,
things won't improve until you go away.


:)

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SteveFoerster
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by SteveFoerster » Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:43 pm

While I don't think she's done particularly well, it's tough to imagine anyone who would have under those circumstances.
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Milo
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by Milo » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:32 pm

I wonder though if this isn't a case of the city of the blind ruled by the one eyed PM!

After all labour didn't vote against Brexit either.

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Alexis
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by Alexis » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:42 pm

No matter what one may think of Theresa May's performance, branding her "the least competent prime minister ever to represent Britain" is just absurd.

:arrow: What about Neville Chamberlain?

"The actual terms of the Withdrawal Agreement are so bad, excluding indefinitely, as they do, all the hoped-for benefits of life outside the EU, while having to accept rules made by it, and paying bills sent in by it, that no one but - it is harsh to use the term, but it is unavoidable - a political fool could have expected to get away with it."
That's a bit premature to assert, to say the least. The withdrawal agreement negotiated by May is not yet dead, and may well end up being approved after all.

Theresa May already has got a 2-to-1 majority for it among Tory MPs. All she needs is for Labour MPs to cave in and approve.

And they may well do just that when she presents them with the alternative of Brexit with this deal, or Brexit without any deal at all. The reason they are so opposed to the agreement is that they hope for Santa Claus to give them what they want: new elections, or a referendum. But Santa Claus won't, and when they realize that, they may well prefer the negotiated agreement to exit without any agreement.

Every day she stays in office, announcing and then pulling parliamentary votes, oscillating between grubby threats and pleas for understanding, selfishly sending her colleagues out to the media to defend what she has already privately decided to concede, traipsing around Europe like some pitiful but unpitied beggar rather than the leader of a great and powerful nation - every such day is another day of national humiliation for which the Conservatives can expect to be punished.
That's very hard to swallow for proud British, I fully understand it. But the root reason is not May's inadequacy nor even "ingrained European spite" as the author asserts. The reason is inability of British leadership including the Parliamen to decide whether they wanted the future relationship with the EU to be as close as possible, or distant.

On the one hand they wanted it to be so close as to allow no physical border in Northern Ireland + maximum access to EU market.

On the other hand they wanted it to be distant enough so as to allow control over European immigration to UK + control over own laws + ability to strike trade deals independently.

One or the other was possible. Not both at the same time. British insistence to pursue both could only result in an awkward compromise. Now the British parliament has to choose between Brexit on these terms, and Brexit without any deal.

And the main cause is inability to make up their minds on a consistent set of goals, for which responsibility is widely shared between government and Parliament, right and left... Not all should fall on the prime minister: she is an all too convenient scapegoat for the others.

neverfail
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Re: Theresa May's pact with the devil?

Post by neverfail » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:18 pm

Alexis,

Thanks for your edifying response.

I thought of Neville Chamberlain when the author accused her of being Britain's most incompetent PM in history but did not mention it in my opening post as I wanted to see whether anyone else would pick that up.

I get the impression that Theresa May has been called upon to achieve the impossible. The British want to have their cake and eat it. This time it cannot be done. So everyone is disappointed.

Theresa May campaigned AGAINST Brexit before the referendum yet as soon as her party elevated her to the job of PM after David Cameron was forced to resign she changed position to become Britain's Brexit negotiator. She could not have been very passionate (or principled) in her opposition to Brexit in the first place. If Brexit is destined to be bad for Britain as its opponents claimed then it means that Ms. May must be acting against her own conscience.

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Sertorio
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by Sertorio » Thu Dec 13, 2018 2:57 am

As long as Theresa May takes Britain away from the EU, that's fine with me. But if I were her, I would have opted for the hard withdrawal, without any formal agreement. After withdrawal Britain couls alway discuss agreements on free trade with the EU, just like Japan or any other country have done. What May has tried to do was taking Britain out of the EU without incurring on any risks on what trade is concerned. That was silly.

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Milo
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by Milo » Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:47 am

Sertorio wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 2:57 am
As long as Theresa May takes Britain away from the EU, that's fine with me. But if I were her, I would have opted for the hard withdrawal, without any formal agreement. After withdrawal Britain couls alway discuss agreements on free trade with the EU, just like Japan or any other country have done. What May has tried to do was taking Britain out of the EU without incurring on any risks on what trade is concerned. That was silly.
I agree, especially with the examples of Norway and Switzerland to draw from, showing that one can do it and do very well by it.

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SteveFoerster
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Re: The worst Prime Minister in history?

Post by SteveFoerster » Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:28 am

Sertorio wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 2:57 am
As long as Theresa May takes Britain away from the EU, that's fine with me. But if I were her, I would have opted for the hard withdrawal, without any formal agreement. After withdrawal Britain couls alway discuss agreements on free trade with the EU, just like Japan or any other country have done. What May has tried to do was taking Britain out of the EU without incurring on any risks on what trade is concerned. That was silly.
I don't envy her position, though. She's doing that because that's what her those in her own party demand, yet she needs also DUP MP's for confidence and supply, and their insistence on no border has left her in an impossible negotiating position with the EU. Especially given she was with Remain, it begets the question why she wanted to be PM in the first place....
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