David Goldman on Russia and the US

Discussion of current events
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Milo
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by Milo » Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:30 pm

Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:53 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm
Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state. The Russian state is merely a vehicle for their enrichment and their politics are only a facade to secure their revenue.
Where is the reliable data supporting this idea of yours?...
Do you deny that Russia has oligarchs? Or do you deny that Putin knows any?

Anyway I will not spend any time on presenting evidence so that you can pretend it is refuted by some blog by Saker, or some other GRU front.

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SteveFoerster
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by SteveFoerster » Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:36 pm

Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:30 pm
Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:53 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm
Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state. The Russian state is merely a vehicle for their enrichment and their politics are only a facade to secure their revenue.
Where is the reliable data supporting this idea of yours?...
Do you deny that Russia has oligarchs? Or do you deny that Putin knows any?

Anyway I will not spend any time on presenting evidence so that you can pretend it is refuted by some blog by Saker, or some other GRU front.
Hear hear!
Writer, technologist, educator, gadfly.
President of New World University: http://newworld.ac

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Sertorio
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by Sertorio » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:02 pm

Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:30 pm
Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:53 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm
Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state. The Russian state is merely a vehicle for their enrichment and their politics are only a facade to secure their revenue.
Where is the reliable data supporting this idea of yours?...
Do you deny that Russia has oligarchs? Or do you deny that Putin knows any?

Anyway I will not spend any time on presenting evidence so that you can pretend it is refuted by some blog by Saker, or some other GRU front.
In other words, you have no evidence for what you stated. Yes, Russia has oligarchs - although not as many as the US - but that doesn't mean that Putin favours them. In fact, he has put a few of them in jail.

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cassowary
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by cassowary » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:41 pm

Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:18 pm
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:37 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm

You don't know what squeezes Putin and what doesn't, because Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state.

So yes, he does care for more than enriching himself and his rich friends.
Oiligarchs want oil prices to be high.
No, they want to make money. There's just as much to be made from low prices as high ones, provided you rig the deck!
Common sense will tell you that they make less money when oil price is low. If not, why does Putin and Opec cut production to boost oil price?

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SteveFoerster
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by SteveFoerster » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:45 am

cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:41 pm
Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:18 pm
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:37 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm

You don't know what squeezes Putin and what doesn't, because Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state.

So yes, he does care for more than enriching himself and his rich friends.
Oiligarchs want oil prices to be high.
No, they want to make money. There's just as much to be made from low prices as high ones, provided you rig the deck!
Common sense will tell you that they make less money when oil price is low. If not, why does Putin and Opec cut production to boost oil price?
If they know when to short before others do, they can make a lot of money off of a price dip.
Writer, technologist, educator, gadfly.
President of New World University: http://newworld.ac

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Milo
Posts: 1409
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2016 10:14 pm

Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by Milo » Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:50 pm

SteveFoerster wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:45 am
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:41 pm
Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:18 pm
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:37 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm

You don't know what squeezes Putin and what doesn't, because Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state.

So yes, he does care for more than enriching himself and his rich friends.
Oiligarchs want oil prices to be high.
No, they want to make money. There's just as much to be made from low prices as high ones, provided you rig the deck!
Common sense will tell you that they make less money when oil price is low. If not, why does Putin and Opec cut production to boost oil price?
If they know when to short before others do, they can make a lot of money off of a price dip.
I don't know why we have to keep telling the putative MBA these things.

neverfail
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by neverfail » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:59 pm

Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:02 pm
Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:30 pm
Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:53 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm
Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state. The Russian state is merely a vehicle for their enrichment and their politics are only a facade to secure their revenue.
Where is the reliable data supporting this idea of yours?...
Do you deny that Russia has oligarchs? Or do you deny that Putin knows any?

Anyway I will not spend any time on presenting evidence so that you can pretend it is refuted by some blog by Saker, or some other GRU front.
In other words, you have no evidence for what you stated. Yes, Russia has oligarchs - although not as many as the US - but that doesn't mean that Putin favours them. In fact, he has put a few of them in jail.
Why should Milo have to provide 'reliable data' to prove that which is obvious to all but you, sertorio?

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Sertorio
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Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by Sertorio » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:03 pm

neverfail wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:59 pm
Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:02 pm
Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:30 pm
Sertorio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:53 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm
Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state. The Russian state is merely a vehicle for their enrichment and their politics are only a facade to secure their revenue.
Where is the reliable data supporting this idea of yours?...
Do you deny that Russia has oligarchs? Or do you deny that Putin knows any?

Anyway I will not spend any time on presenting evidence so that you can pretend it is refuted by some blog by Saker, or some other GRU front.
In other words, you have no evidence for what you stated. Yes, Russia has oligarchs - although not as many as the US - but that doesn't mean that Putin favours them. In fact, he has put a few of them in jail.
Why should Milo have to provide 'reliable data' to prove that which is obvious to all but you, sertorio?
Obvious without any evidence?... I wish I was as smart as you people... I may have my opinions, but without hard evidence I would only be falling prey to my prejudices... Just like you...

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cassowary
Posts: 2308
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:30 pm

Re: Watch what Trump does and not what he says.

Post by cassowary » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:32 pm

Milo wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:50 pm
SteveFoerster wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:45 am
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:41 pm
Milo wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:18 pm
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:37 am
Milo wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:18 pm

You don't know what squeezes Putin and what doesn't, because Putin's interests lie in pleasing a handful of oiligarchs, not in the affairs of the Russian state.

So yes, he does care for more than enriching himself and his rich friends.
Oiligarchs want oil prices to be high.
No, they want to make money. There's just as much to be made from low prices as high ones, provided you rig the deck!
Common sense will tell you that they make less money when oil price is low. If not, why does Putin and Opec cut production to boost oil price?
If they know when to short before others do, they can make a lot of money off of a price dip.
I don't know why we have to keep telling the putative MBA these things.
The key word is “if”. If they bet wrong they lose lots of $$$.

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lzzrdgrrl
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Location: Okie Doke

Re: David Goldman on Russia and the US

Post by lzzrdgrrl » Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:38 pm

Too much Russia, needs moar China......'>......
I have a certain notoriety among the lesser gods........

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