2020: turning the White House into an Oprah House.

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Milo
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Re: Another arrogant billionnaire for president?

Post by Milo » Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:59 am

neverfail wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:40 pm
cassowary wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:22 am
neverfail wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:26 pm
cassowary wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:42 pm

Maybe English speaking people don't like or look down on French speaking people? Or maybe Oprah simply was in a bad mood that day?
I have experienced it myself Cass. I first went to France in 1975 and with the exception of a small number of notable Anglophile exceptions, the French had a strict rule in those days - 'have the good manners to speak French to us whilst you are visiting our country or else you can bugger off'.

French people seemed to carry around the attitude that "unless you are French then you must be a barbarian". In that the French remind me of the Chinese: 'if you are not Chinese then you are a foreign devil'. You know how it is with the crowd back in your ancestral homeland?

Luckily, I had been forewarned about this apparent French vanity about their language, culture and national identity and made a point of learning some very basic French beforehand. MY French vocabulary is still quite limited but I seem to have a talent for "tuning in" to their type of pronunciation and using it to my benefit. More than one native French speaker has complemented me on that ability.

I found that in France on two widely spaced apart separate visits I did not need to be fluent in French anyway. The important thing is to try and put yourself in their shoes and show that "you are with them in spirit".

Too many Anglo travelers visit foreign countries with the naive opinion that they can always rely on the locals to speak to them in English and then find out the hard way that it is not always true. That's when the trouble starts.
Yes, the French are like that. The result is mutual dislike.
Not entirely true Cass. French people can be surprisingly Anglophone (as I believe polls have shown). Yet the way they go on at times makes this hard to believe.

It is not just us. They do not like to speak ANY foreign language in their own country - not just english.

As a lady from one of the provincial regions of France once pointed out to me: even when they go to Paris the Parisians get on their back berating them for speaking in their provincial patios. Only pure Parisian French is acceptable.

France, we must recall, is a country that revolves entirely around its primate city capital. Historically, I get the impression that the city of Paris existed before the nation of France was over centuries built up around it to serve the capital city. That dynamic is still in operation holding France together even now. So lacking the clear topographic bounds of containment and demarcation that goes with being an island nation, language along with the sense of belonging to an important country with a global mission to perform counts for a lot.

There is not a single metropolis in the english speaking lands that comes anywhere close to Paris in the Francophone lands as the unifying trend setter for their/our civilisation.
The same goes for Quebec, except a strain of patios is the dominant French.

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SteveFoerster
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Re: Another arrogant billionnaire for president?

Post by SteveFoerster » Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:43 am

neverfail wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:40 pm
There is not a single metropolis in the english speaking lands that comes anywhere close to Paris in the Francophone lands as the unifying trend setter for their/our civilisation.
That's an interesting observation. It's not London anymore when there's New York, but is New York as culturally influential as L.A., when the latter is where Hollywood is? Hmm.
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neverfail
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Re: Another arrogant billionnaire for president?

Post by neverfail » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:35 pm

SteveFoerster wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:43 am
neverfail wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:40 pm
There is not a single metropolis in the english speaking lands that comes anywhere close to Paris in the Francophone lands as the unifying trend setter for their/our civilisation.
That's an interesting observation. It's not London anymore when there's New York, but is New York as culturally influential as L.A., when the latter is where Hollywood is? Hmm.
Yes, I agree. As the citizen of a country whose way of life has been cross-fertilised by inputs both of British civilisation and American culture, I believe that London still wields an authority in its own right that still favourably compares to that of New York and LA. In my eyes:

whereas
Britain = roots, heritage.
The USA = restless energy, constant change.

A country that can draw in the best of both is blessed.

In any case; whereas Anglo civilisation seems to be multi-nodal Franco civilisation is entirely mono nodal.

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